Very ill young female

[Vikki123]

Hello

My female glider has become very thin very fast! She is still eating, but this morning she came out at 11:30 am ish. I never see my gliders out in the day, so this worried me a little.

When she emerged from her bed, I noticed her dramatic weight loss and she was moving slowly. Within half an hour we were at the vets with her. He wasn't sure what is wrong, but gave her an antibiotic injection, along with giving us a critical care formula and checking her stools for any parasites or other bowl problems and the results were negative.

Tonight she is a lot worse, although she has eaten a little she started to lay on the floor of her cage.

The male isn't showing any signs of illness and his weight is absolutely fine. Both are rescues from separate homes and the males last mate died (just in case there's any possibility of the male carrying anything).

I have added some nuts and a little bit of boiled egg into her food to give her more protein.

All of their food contains fresh fruits, pumpkin seeds, occasional almonds/walnuts, meal worms, crickets, and it all gets sprinkled with a little nutrabal for calcium.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated or if anyone has had any similar experiences I would be very grateful.

Thank you very much

Vikki x

[Marie]

Hi Vikki, glad you made it over, I replied on RFUK with this

Is she still eating? - which you say she is, in that case how much?  Is she getting enough?

Is she dehydrated? A simple 'tent test' on the back of the neck should tell - pinch a piece of skin and if it doesn't spring back in to place then she could be dehydrated.

Does she have any injuries?

Where is she kept and what temps do you keep them at, are there any draughts?

What do you feed them?  Needs a little tweaking, there is no need to give them nuts or seeds TBH, the only think I could think of there is a possible hypo?

Does she have runny poos?

Any vomiting?

Have you noticed anything odd about her over the past day or two?

 

If you can tonight, keep her warm, syringe feed with the critical care and you need to make sure she eats.

[loulou]

Also has she been eating? has her cage mate been stopping her from getting to the bowl?

Marie has covered everything else

[Vikki123]

Hi thanks for getting back to me

She is eating

She doesn't seem dehydrated and she did take some fluids off us anyway

She doesn't seem to have any injuries, although the vet thought that there may have been a tiny bit of blood on her, but she had strawberries the night before, so not sure if it was that.

She is kept in a large cage with a male and they are kept at warm temperatures - I keep reptiles in the same room, so it stays at around 24-28 degrees C. no draughts.

They're on fresh fruits (eg, grapes, blueberries, mangoes), crickets, mealworms, pumpkin seeds, the occasional nut (almonds or walnuts), honey as a treat and all of their food gets dusted with Nutrabal, for their calcium.

No runny poos or vomiting

Only noticed a change in her behaviour today. She has always been smaller than the male and they were both rescues from different homes. (If it helps the males previous mate did die, but as he was a confiscated rescue that could have been due to neglect)

She has always been the one to beat the male to food, she even steals food off him sometimes.

Thanks for everything - I'm really worried about her

Vikki x

[Mark]

Hi there, sorry to hear about yr glider, I tried to reply more on rfuk but I was working and got dragged away. How long have u had her? As marie said yr diet does need a little tweaking, pimkin seeds and honey are not really needed. U need to keep her warm as marie said and get the criticle care in little and often.

[Marie]

The temps seem fine, I'm slightly more concerned now you mention grapes to be honest, did the vet do urine samples to check for renal (kidney) problems? 

Do you have any baby food? If not Can anyone go and fetch any?  The one I recommend it Ella's Kitchen, it's pure fruit/veg.  I would continue to offer her fluids (critical care), I'd also put a bit of honey in to her mouth (if she's that weak) or let her lick it if she can to bring her blood sugars back up.  I'd also syringe baby food in to her mouth and try to get her to eat.  How long ago did she really start to go downhill?

[Vikki123]

Hi,
We did not realise (green) grapes would be an issue. A book we have on sugar gliders says they are good as they are low in phosphorous.

we've given her some honey.
The vet didn't take any urine samples, but we will be calling him tomorrow to let him know how she is gettin on and will mention it to him then.

Sorry, could you clarify

" the only think I could think of there is a possible hypo"?

mainly the hypo bit

Many Thanks

Paul (Vikki's boyfriend - she's just giving Gizmo some critical care)

[Vikki123]

after reading what you said about grapes,

i found this

http://www.sugar-gliders.com/glidervet-53.htm

we are now taking grapes out of their diet, just in case.

will mention it to the vets tomorrow

oops sorry nearly forgot to answer the question about when she went down hill:

last night she seemed fine, this morning we were surprised to see her up at around 11:30 am, and she looked, well, scrawny is probably the best word and she was very slow and quiet. We had her at the vets within 30 minutes.

Cheers

Paul (Vikki's boyfriend and scribe)

[Marie]

The problem with suggie books is that most of them are old, so when new things come to light they're not updated.  I'd avoid grapes of any colour TBH, Lou on here lost two of her beloved skunks to grapes.  

A hypo is when the blood sugars drop, it can cause them to fit and in one case the suggie went blind but did regain her sight a few months later.  It's linked to diabetes.  It is a case of bringing the levels back up and feed less sugary foods including fruit and feed more vegetable items.  

My other thought and the reason I asked about temps is because they sometimes go in to a semi hibernation called torpor, it is a natural reaction to adverse weather conditions in the wild, the only difference is there is they live in large colonies in the wild so they can keep each other warm, thet cannot seem to do this with just one other suggie, they tend to look dead and be absolutely frozen, but I don't think that is what the problem is.  

[loulou]

oh god renal failure could be a high possibility and if not failure then damage.

Is she passing urine? if not get her to the vet again ASAP the final stages of renal (kidney) failure is the inability to pass urine as the kidneys have given up. Kidney failure has very similar symptoms to torpor and it can cause the glider to lose weight dramatically, be wobbly, lose the ability to use some or all limbs, lethargic, no appetite, sick, passing less and less urine, drop in body temp which can result in torpor, shaking,

Not all of those symptoms will or do show but they can also show for other things. Renal failure is fatal and renal damage can be as well so a vet needs to be made aware of the risks grapes can cause. When you go back tell your vet grapes effect gliders exactly as they effect dogs and parrots and your glider will need to be treated in the same way, a good vet will understand and know what to do.

[Vikki123]

we think she just had a fit

she started to crab more than usual and kind of thrash around, we thought she was perking up.

if she is hypoglycaemic, i'm guessing we should add sugar to her critical care solution, or just keep giving it to her every hour or so?

She started to fit just as vikki was giving her some more solution, so we are a little bit wary of syringe feeding her now.

we also noticed a discharge from above the base of her tail (i.e. urethra or vagina), it was a yellow/brown if it was urine it's not the normal colour, we weren't sure how to keep it for the vet, so figured for now we would wipe it away, again, we'll let the vet know this tomorrow too



in response to the new post, she's not really lost her appetite, but like you said, not all symptoms will be present.

[Rhianna]

a browny red tinge to the urine indicates kidney problems. I would say get to a vet who can treat exotics and tell him about suspected kidney failure. He may be able to check to be sure and try to treat for you.

I hope everything goes well. Fingers crossed.

[Marie]

You must continue to syringe feed, honey is a simple sugar which is why I recommended you either put it in her mouth or let her lick it if she can.  Can you try and get baby food in to her as well as the care formula?  Could the discharge have been a runny poo? 

Lou beat me to it! 

[Vikki123]

it's definitely a yellow/brown more yellow, definitely doesn't seem red

yup we've got baby food

potato and carrots

and

banana and rice pudding

are either of these any good? if not i'll go out and get some more

(we believe they are ok with banana and carrots, but not sure about the rice and potatoes.)

she's taking the formula from the bowl now, but seems to have stopped eating for now. she's not eaten as much as normal yet.

Could also be exhaustion? (she's had a busy day and evening )

[Marie]

Ok, so she's eaten on her own, that's good.  Keep offering it to her as well as honey and critical care.  She won't eat as much as normal becuase she's not feeling well.  I'd go with the potato and carrot food, but she might prefer something sweeter, try adding some honey to it, if she turns her nose up try a sweeter one.